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UKPC PCN while delivering for Amazon Flex – POPLA advice needed
#1
Got a UKPC parking charge while carrying out an Amazon Flex delivery at Moat Lane, Nine Elms Park Embassy Gardens

I appealed directly to UKPC and received the standard rejection stating the vehicle was “parked in an area where no parking is allowed.” I already identified myself as the driver.

Facts:
• Brief stop while carrying out delivery activity
• Vehicle was actively being used for loading/unloading
• Now preparing a POPLA appeal

My current arguments are:
• Active loading/unloading is different from parking
• “No parking” signage may be prohibitive rather than contractual
• UKPC should prove landowner authority

Has anyone successfully challenged UKPC or similar tickets at POPLA in delivery/loading cases? Especially interested in relevant POPLA decisions or wording that worked.
#2
Welcome to the forum @ibadusaf. It's a pity you outed yourself as the driver but not to worry. Whilst this will not win at any appeal (initial or POPLA), it will never reach a hearing in court, although a claim will be issued.

As long as you follow the advice you receive here, you won't be paying a penny to UKPC. However, it will be a long drawn out process where you will go through useless debt recovery letters, a county court claim and eventual discontinuation by DCB Legal who are the bulk litigation firm of choice for UKPC.

I can assure you that any county court claim issued by DCB Legal on behalf of UKPC, as long as it is defended, will be discontinued. It's a loss leader for them to issue a county court claim because the vast majority of the low-hanging fruit on the gullible tree will just pay up out of ignorance and fear of the process. The minority of defendants who follow the advice and actually defend the claim are pleasantly surprised when they receive their N279 Notice of Discontinuance.

So, are you prepared to follow the advice?

Please show the Notice to Keeper (NtK) you received and I can assist with your POPLA appeal. POPLA are pretty useless in these cases but as long as you can properly point out legal defects in their case, you have a slight chance of getting decent assessor, not one of the useless morons they mostly employ.
Never argue with stupid people. They will drag you down to their level and then beat you with experience. - Mark Twain
#3
Thanks for the response.

Understood regarding identifying myself as the driver — lesson learned there.

I’m prepared to follow the advice and defend it properly if necessary. I’ll upload the NtK shortly.


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#4
As I mentioned, this will never reach a hearing in court. However, any defence would cite Jopson v Homeguard Services Ltd [2016] B9GF0A9E.

You can also try citing it in your POPLA appeal, but as I mentioned, you are not dealing with an impartial or independent adjudicator and likely to be ignorant of the actual legal implications.

A 17-minute stop is not a “momentary” stop in the everyday sense, so I would avoid presenting it as if it were a 2 or 3-minute delivery. The better argument is that the vehicle was stopped for the duration reasonably required to complete active delivery activity at a large residential/mixed-use development, especially where there were multiple deliveries, controlled access, lifts, concierge/reception points, several blocks, or distance between the vehicle and delivery addresses.

The key Jopson point is paragraph 21: whether the vehicle was “parked” or merely stopped for unloading/delivery is a question of fact and degree. That allows you to say that 17 minutes is not automatically “parking” if the whole period was occupied by delivery activity and the vehicle was not left for the driver’s personal convenience.

I would frame it like this:

Quote:The operator appears to have treated the vehicle as “parked” merely because it was stationary for 17 minutes. That is an error. The issue is not simply whether the vehicle was stationary, but why it was stationary and what the driver was doing during that period.

The vehicle was being used for Amazon Flex delivery activity at a large residential development. The 17-minute duration was reasonably required to complete delivery activity to multiple properties at that location. This included the time needed to locate the relevant block or blocks, access the building, complete delivery to the recipient address or addresses, return to the vehicle and depart. That is not parking in the ordinary contractual sense. It is active loading/unloading and delivery activity.

In Jopson v Homeguard [2016] B9GF0A9E, HHJ Harris QC made clear that there is a real distinction between parking and stopping for delivery, loading or unloading. At paragraph 21, the judge explained that whether a vehicle is parked or merely stopped for loading/unloading is a question of fact and degree. The judgment expressly recognises that delivery activity may require the driver to leave the vehicle while goods are taken to the relevant premises. That reasoning applies here.

UKPC has provided no evidence that the driver was parked for personal convenience, nor that the vehicle was abandoned or left for any purpose unrelated to the delivery. The appellant’s evidence is that the vehicle was stopped only for the period necessary to complete delivery activity. UKPC is put to strict proof that the vehicle was not being used for loading/unloading or delivery activity throughout the material period.

The appellant will provide Amazon Flex evidence showing that delivery activity was being carried out at or around the material time. In a location such as Moat Lane, Nine Elms Park / Embassy Gardens, 17 minutes is entirely consistent with multiple delivery drops within a large development and is not evidence of parking.


I would also add something like this if there is Amazon evidence:

Quote:The appellant invites POPLA to consider the delivery evidence in context. Amazon Flex deliveries are time-stamped and route-based. The appellant was not visiting the site as a shopper, resident, guest or commuter. The sole purpose of the stop was commercial delivery activity. The operator’s photographs do not rebut that. They merely show a stationary vehicle, which is not the same thing as proof of parking in breach of contractual terms.


Evidence to include, if available:
  • Amazon Flex itinerary screenshot showing the location and time.
  • Number of parcels/drops at Moat Lane / Embassy Gardens.
  • Screenshots showing delivery completion times.
  • Any Amazon map/route screenshot.
  • Any notes showing difficulty accessing the building, concierge, intercom, lifts, or multiple blocks.
  • A short witness statement from the driver explaining the sequence of events.

The POPLA appeal should not say “brief stop” too often if the duration is 17 minutes. Say “temporary stop for active delivery/loading activity” instead. That is more accurate and harder for the assessor to dismiss.
Never argue with stupid people. They will drag you down to their level and then beat you with experience. - Mark Twain
#5
Just submitted my POPLA appeal for the private parking charge.

Thanks for the advice — really helped me understand how to structure it properly, especially around the delivery activity and evidence side of things.

Now just waiting to see what the outcome is.
#6
Don’t pin your hopes on POPLA. If unsuccessful, their decision is not binding on you. You don’t pay.
Never argue with stupid people. They will drag you down to their level and then beat you with experience. - Mark Twain
#7
           
Update on my POPLA appeal – unfortunately unsuccessful

Hi, regarding the POPLA appeal you helped me with.

I followed your advice and submitted the appeal explaining that I was doing Amazon Flex deliveries at the time and that the vehicle was only stopped temporarily to complete the deliveries. I also provided the Amazon block details as evidence that I was actively working at the time.

Unfortunately, POPLA has now rejected the appeal.

The assessor acknowledged pretty much everything I explained. They accepted that I may have been carrying out Amazon Flex deliveries and that deliveries in a large residential development can require the driver to leave the vehicle, access buildings, use lifts, etc. They also considered the point about **Jopson v Homeguard**, where temporary stopping for loading/unloading and deliveries can be different from parking.

However, they said the main issue was that this was a clearly marked **"No Parking" area**, rather than a situation where I had exceeded a permitted parking period. They said there was no exemption on the signs for delivery drivers and that my Amazon Flex evidence only showed why I was there, but did not prove I was authorised to stop in the no-parking area.

They also relied on the Private Parking Sector Single Code of Practice and **ParkingEye v Beavis [2015] UKSC 67**, saying the signs were clear and the restriction was adequately communicated.

Their conclusion was basically that, even though they accepted I was likely making deliveries, they considered the vehicle to have been stopped in a no-parking area and therefore refused the appeal.
 
What do you think would be the best thing to do now? 

Thanks again for helping me.
#8
@ibadusaf, the fact that POPLA did not uphold your appeal does not mean that you now have to pay UKPC. POPLA's decision does not amount to a court judgment. POPLA itself confirms that, following an unsuccessful appeal, the operator will expect payment and that POPLA will not reconsider the appeal; if the charge continues to be disputed, the matter can ultimately only be determined through the ordinary legal process.

DO NOT pay anything simply because POPLA has rejected the appeal.

It would be useful if you could post the full POPLA decision, including the name of the assessor, because I keep track of their decisions and reasoning. Please insert some paragraph breaks rather than reproducing the usual POPLA wall of text.

From your description, there appears to be a fairly obvious problem with the assessor's reasoning and proves that they have very little actual knowledge of the legislation.

The assessor apparently distinguished Jopson v Homeguard Services Ltd [2016] B9GF0A9E on the basis that this was a "No Parking" area. That does not dispose of Jopson at all. In fact, it goes directly to the point HHJ Harris QC considered.

At paragraph 19 of Jopson, the judge expressly dealt with a purported prohibition upon parking, and distinguished that from the temporary stopping necessary to enable passengers to alight or goods to be loaded or unloaded. At paragraph 20 he went further and explained that the concept of parking involves leaving a vehicle for longer than is required for such activities; simply stopping a vehicle does not automatically make it "parked". The judgment specifically recognised the practical necessity of delivery vehicles stopping while goods are taken to premises.

So saying, in effect, "this was a no-parking area, therefore Jopson does not apply" rather misses the point. The question remains whether what you were actually doing amounted to parking, as prohibited by the sign, or temporary stopping for the purpose of carrying out the delivery.

Nor does simply citing ParkingEye v Beavis [2015] UKSC 67 resolve that question. Beavis concerned a motorist who had actually parked in a retail car park offering two hours' free parking and remained for 56 minutes beyond the permitted two-hour period. The Supreme Court considered whether the £85 contractual charge arising from that overstay was an unenforceable penalty and whether the parking scheme served a legitimate interest.

It did not decide that every stationary vehicle is "parked"; it did not concern loading or commercial deliveries; and it did not establish that displaying a sign automatically converts every prohibited activity into an enforceable contractual parking charge. BeforeBeavis becomes relevant to the amount or enforceability of a charge, UKPC still has to establish the underlying contractual basis for liability in the circumstances of this particular case.

Likewise, an industry Code of Practice does not somehow override the legal distinction considered by a Circuit Judge on appeal in Jopson. A code may prescribe standards for signage and parking management, but it does not determine, as a matter of law and fact, whether a particular activity amounts to "parking".

What happens next? They will now try and intimidate you into paying their charge. You will start to receive debt recovery letters. You can safely ignore all those. Debt collectors are powerless to do anything except to try and intimidate the low-hanging fruit on the gullible tree into paying out of ignorance and fear.

Debt recovery letters mean nothing. They cannot affect your credit rating and there is nothing on your credit record, no matter how many you receive. Use them as kindling or to line the bottom of a cat litter tray, for all anyone cares. Do not be intimidated by them.

Ordinary debt collectors have no court judgment to enforce. Merely receiving those letters does not create a CCJ or place a judgment on your credit record. A judgment only exists if court proceedings result in the court formally deciding that money is owed. Even then, a County Court judgment paid in full within one month is removed from the register.

So debt recovery correspondence can safely be treated as noise. Do not, however, ignore a genuine Letter of Claim (Loc) or an actual County Court claim.

If a bulk litigation solicitor sends an LoC, post it here. We will respond properly under the Pre-Action Protocol for Debt Claims, dispute the alleged debt and require the relevant documents and evidence. The Protocol expressly provides for the debtor to respond and request documentation, and requires the creditor to provide requested information or explain why it is unavailable.

If UKPC ultimately issues a County Court claim, that claim can easily be defended. You have already preserved useful contemporaneous evidence showing that you were carrying out Amazon Flex deliveries, and Jopson would form an important part of the defence. We would also examine the exact wording and positioning of UKPC's signs, whether those signs actually offered a contractual licence capable of acceptance, UKPC's authority from the landholder, the precise alleged contractual breach, and whatever evidence UKPC produces concerning the alleged 17-minute "parking" event.

Most importantly, don't confuse POPLA's opinion with a judicial determination. POPLA has finished its involvement. UKPC can demand payment; you can continue to dispute liability. If UKPC wants a legally enforceable determination against you, it ultimately has to persuade a court.
Never argue with stupid people. They will drag you down to their level and then beat you with experience. - Mark Twain


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