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30 min overstay - Printable Version +- Private Parking Ticket Legal Advice (PPTLA) (https://pptla.uk) +-- Forum: Legal advice forum (https://pptla.uk/forumdisplay.php?fid=3) +--- Forum: Parking Charge Notices forum (https://pptla.uk/forumdisplay.php?fid=4) +--- Thread: 30 min overstay (/showthread.php?tid=100) |
30 min overstay - Tezzy - 08-03-2026 This case concerns a Parking Charge Notice (private parking firm) issued by Smart Parking Ltd, relating to an alleged contravention on Sunday, 12 July 2026. The notice itself is dated Tuesday, 28 July 2026, and I first became aware of it via received initial notice. The notice appears to have been issued as By post (ANPR/camera). Driver identified status: NO. Equality Act considerations: No. The location is stated as The Embankment-Stratford upon Avon. A preliminary Protection of Freedoms Act (PoFA) assessment indicates NON_COMPLIANT: Likely outside PoFA paragraph 9 timing window. Route applied: PoFA paragraph 9 (postal NtK, no windscreen NtD). The notice is treated as given on Thursday, 30 July 2026 (18 days after the alleged event). On this basis, keeper liability may not be established. Current stage: - Notice responded to: No - Debt recovery letters: No - Letter of Claim: No - County Court claim: No Additional notes provided: Charge is for overstay of approx 30 mins. Paid for 2 hours via RingGo 07:52 - 09:52. ANPR time 07:50 - 10:23. £100 reduced to £60 if paid within 14 days of issue. Letter received today 03/08/26 Please can I have advice on the strongest next steps and defence points for this case. RE: 30 min overstay - Brenda_R2 - 08-03-2026 A private parking charge (Notice to Keeper under POFA 2012) must be served within 14 days of the alleged contravention for keeper liability to apply. Yours appears to have been issued 16 days after the alleged contravention. Ergo, no keeper liability can exist. @b789 will be along shortly with an excellently worded reply you can use as an appeal. To manage your expectations though - your appeal will almost certainly fail, not because it lacks merit but because this is all about revenue generation......buckle up, you're in for a ride that might well last a year and will involve all manner of threatening letters telling you your whole world is going to collapse around you if you don't cough up. If they’re foolish enough to litigate, you win — because POFA is statutory law, not optional guidance. Stay strong, this is easily winnable so long as you don't blab who the driver was; here, on Facebook, anywhere in fact. RE: 30 min overstay - b789 - 08-04-2026 Wise words there from @Brenda_R2. @Tezzy, welcome to the forum. You are the proud recipient of a Parking Charge Notice (PCN) in the form of a Notice to Keeper (NtK). The single most important mantra in this (and any other) case is to NEVER, EVER, identify the driver. The scammers at (not so) Smart Parking have absolutely no idea who the driver is. All they know is that you are the registered keeper. The ONLY way they could ever find out who the driver is, is if YOU tell them. There is absolutely no legal obligation to identify the driver to an unregulated private parking firm. They are not allowed to assume or infer that because you are the Keeper that you therefore must also be the driver. They will try and intimidate you by saying otherwise, but all you have to remember is this is a firm of scammers who are only interested in your money. The PCN is nothing but a speculative invoice for an alleged breach of contract by the driver. According to (not so) Smart Parking, the driver entered into a contract with them when they parked at the location. So, ONLY the driver can be liable. They do not know the name and address of the driver and so they have sent the invoice to you in the hope you will just pay it or give them the drivers details so they can pursue that unknown (to them) person. There is a law in England and Wales called the Protection of Freedoms Act 2012 (PoFA). This law was enacted to give these parasitic parking firms an option to hold the Keeper of the vehicle liable if the driver is not identified. However, in order to be able to do so, they must FULLY comply with ALL the requirements of that Act. If they do, then they can hold the Keeper liable for the actions of the unknown (to them) driver. In this case, they have not even attempted to try and use the Act. The most glaring failure to do so (to anyone familiar with the Act) is that they failed to serve (give) the NtK within the 14 relevant period. They must issue the NtK so that it can be given by post within 14 days of the alleged contravention. They must allow 2 working days for delivery. So, if the alleged contravention was on 12 July and the NtK was "issued" on Tuesday 28 July, it is deemed "given" on Thursday 30 July. That is 18 days after the alleged contravention and therefore not even close to the "relevant period" as mandated by PoFA. On top of that, there is a whole host of other requirements that must be met if they intend to try and rely on PoFA to hold the Keeper liable for the charge. (Not so) Smart Parking have not even attempted to even try and rely on PoFA in this case. So, whilst @Brenda_R2, is correct when they say that this is going to be a long drawn out affair, they are correct, because scamming firms like (not so) Smart Parking will hope that you are low-hanging fruit on the gullible tree and will eventually just give in and pay them anyway, out of ignorance and fear. The reason it takes so long, with very little effort required by you except patience and trust, is because the initial appeal is almost ALWAYS rejected. That is because there is no money in it for them if they accept the appeal. Once the initial appeal is rejected, you move on to the secondary appeal with the IAS. The IAS is a kangaroo court. It is owned and operated by the same people that the parking firms pay membership to in order to be able to get DVLA Keeper data, the IPC. The IAS is another scam where adjudicators pretend to be qualified solicitors (they are not) and their sole reason d'être is to look after their members income by rejecting over 95% of all appeals, irrespective of the argument. Once that appeal is rejected, there is no legal obligation to pay. Any decision by the IAS is NOT binding on you. They will then start to send useless debt recovery letters. You need to understand that debt collectors are powerless to do anything except to also try and intimidate the low-hanging fruit into paying out of ignorance and fear. You can safely ignore the debt recovery letters. Use them as kindling or to line the bottom of a cat litter tray. Absolutely NOTHING will happen. Eventually, they are most likely to use a firm of incompetent bulk litigation solicitors to issue a Letter of Claim (LoC) before they issue a county court claim in the small claims track. All this is designed to intimidate the victim into giving up and paying (by then) an increased amount. However, as I have already pointed out, the ONLY person that can be liable for the invoice is the driver. As the Keeper, there can be no liability. They know this but hope that you don't and which is why they will press on up until the very last moment before a hearing before a judge. At this point, they will discontinue. It's just that the whole process takes a lot of time. WE are here to assist you through this process. You will learn some useful life lessons and why you should nt become that low-hanging fruit that they hope you are. So, for the initial appeal, you do so ONLY as the Keeper. You only ever refer to the driver in the third person. No "I did this or that". only " the driver did this or that". Do not select anything on their appeal website that infers that the appellant is the driver. You are ONLY appealing as the Keeper. If available, select "other": Quote:I am the keeper of the vehicle and I dispute your 'parking charge'. I deny any liability or contractual agreement and I will be making a complaint about your predatory conduct to your client landowner. RE: 30 min overstay - Tezzy - 08-24-2026 Thankyou @b789 and @Brenda_R2. You were quite correct and a reply (below) has been received. What would the next course of action be please? Thank you for your recent communication. Having considered your appeal in detail we have decided to uphold the Parking Charge (PC) as we believe that it was correctly issued in accordance with the terms and conditions advertised within the area concerned. As your appeal was received within the initial discount period, we have extended the discount period until 08/09/2026. The PC was issued because the vehicle was parked in breach of the terms and conditions displayed on signage at the location. After carefully reviewing the information you have provided, we are satisfied that the PC was issued correctly and therefore your appeal has been unsuccessful. You have confirmed that you are the registered keeper of the vehicle but have declined to identify the driver at the time of the parking event. As the keeper, you were invited to provide the full name and serviceable address of the driver if you were not the person in control of the vehicle on the date in question. You have not done so. While the provisions of Protection of Freedoms Act 2012 Schedule 4 relating to keeper liability do not apply at this location, this does not prevent us from pursuing the individual who was responsible for the vehicle at the time of the contravention. In the absence of driver details, and based on the information available, we are entitled to reasonably infer that the keeper was also the driver. This position has been supported in case law, including Elliott v Loake, where the court accepted that keeper responsibility may give rise to a reasonable inference as to the identity of the driver when no alternative explanation is provided. You have not produced any evidence to demonstrate that you were not the driver, nor have you provided the details of the person who was driving. Accordingly, we are satisfied on the balance of probabilities that you were the driver at the time of the parking event and remain liable for the outstanding charge. Having noted your comments, we are satisfied that the Parking Charge has been issued correctly and your appeal is rejected. We can confirm that the Parking Charge was issued due to insufficient paid time. Our payment system shows that 120 minutes was purchased against vehicle however, your vehicle remained on site for a total of 153 minutes. Additional time can be purchased at any point during your stay, before exiting the car park. As your vehicle was parked in excess of the parking time purchased, the advertised terms and conditions have been breached. You have now reached the end of our internal appeals procedure and therefore you now have two options, you can pay or appeal further with IAS – you cannot do both. The Appellant has the right to appeal to an Independent Appeals Service, (IAS) using the instructions below. Please note, should you decide to appeal to the IAS, and your appeal is subsequently rejected, the option to pay a discounted amount will no longer be available and the full amount of the PC will be due. If the appellant decides to appeal to the IAS, they will need to visit the website, https://www.theias.org/ where further details of how to appeal can be found. The appellant has 28 days from the date of this letter to submit an appeal to IAS. Alternatively, your 3 payment options are: • By Post: Please send a cheque or postal order (payable to Smart Parking Ltd) to Smart Parking Ltd, Unit 43, Elmdon Trading Estate, Bickenhill Lane, Marston Green, Birmingham B37 7HE. • By Web: To make a payment online with a debit or credit card, please visit www.smartparking.com and have your Parking Charge number to hand. • By Phone: Pay via our 24 hour automated telephone payment service on 0330 057 6230. Please have your Parking Charge number to hand. Please note that calls to this number cost up to 7p per minute, plus your phone company’s access charge. Yours sincerely, Smart Parking Limited RE: 30 min overstay - b789 - 08-24-2026 @Tezzy, this rejection is exactly the sort of nonsense we expected from (not so) Smart Parking. It does not alter your position and it does not create any liability on your part as the Registered Keeper (RK). The most important sentence in the rejection is this admission: Quote:"The provisions of Protection of Freedoms Act 2012 Schedule 4 relating to keeper liability do not apply at this location." That admission is fatal to any claim against you as Keeper. The alleged parking contract could only have been entered into by the driver. The driver therefore remains the only person potentially liable for any alleged breach of that contract unless liability has been lawfully transferred to the Keeper under Schedule 4 of the Protection of Freedoms Act 2012 (PoFA). PoFA is the only statutory mechanism by which a private parking operator can transfer an unidentified driver's alleged liability to the (RK). It contains detailed and mandatory conditions which the operator must satisfy before that transfer can occur. Here, (not so) Smart Parking has expressly admitted that Schedule 4 Keeper liability does not apply. In any event, its Notice to Keeper (NtK) was not even issued until 16 days after the alleged event and was not deemed delivered until 18 days afterwards, well outside the 14-day relevant period required for an ANPR postal notice. Accordingly:
The invented "keeper was probably the driver”" argument Having admitted that it cannot use PoFA, (not so) Smart Parking has attempted to manufacture an alternative form of Keeper liability. It says that because you are the Keeper and have declined to identify the driver, it may "reasonably infer" that you were driving. That is a mendacious sham. There is no legal presumption that a vehicle's RK was its driver. Nor is an RK legally required to identify the driver to an unregulated private parking company. Your refusal to provide that information does not:
The DVLA record proves only that you were the registered keeper. ANPR photographs showing the vehicle entering and leaving the car park prove only that the vehicle was present. Neither identifies the person driving it. If a parking operator could avoid PoFA merely by saying, "The keeper has not named the driver, so we will treat the keeper as the driver", PoFA would be pointless. Parliament would not have needed to create a detailed statutory scheme governing the transfer of liability from an unknown driver to a known Keeper. (not so) Smart Parking cannot obtain through an invented inference the precise transfer of liability that PoFA does not permit. Why Elliott v Loake does not help them (not so) Smart Parking's reliance upon Elliott v Loake [1982] Crim LR 36 is utterly ridiculous. That case was not about private parking, Keeper liability or an alleged breach of contract. It was a criminal road-traffic prosecution arising from a collision after which the vehicle left the scene. The prosecution possessed substantive evidence connecting Mr Elliott and his vehicle with the collision. That included forensic evidence concerning damage to the vehicle, evidence about his possession and control of it, and findings that the account he gave was untrue. The court reached its decision from the particular evidence in that criminal case. The court did not decide that:
None of the evidence present in Elliott v Loake exists here. There has been no collision, police investigation, forensic examination, demonstrably false account or other evidence identifying you as the driver. There is only a Registered Keeper who has exercised the perfectly lawful right not to identify the driver. The former Lead Adjudicator of POPLA, barrister Henry Greenslade, explained the position unequivocally: Quote:"There is no 'reasonable presumption' in law that the registered keeper of a vehicle is the driver. Operators should never suggest anything of the sort." He also confirmed that a Keeper's failure to name the driver does not mean that the Keeper has accepted being the driver. Consequently, Elliott v Loake has absolutely no relevance to this parking charge. (not so) Smart Parking is citing an unrelated criminal case and pretending that it established a rule which it did not establish. What happens next The next stage will be an appeal to the IAS, submitted within 28 days of the rejection. We will prepare that appeal separately. You must continue to act only as the Registered Keeper and must not identify the driver. The IAS may allow the appeal. However, it is more likely to accept (not so) Smart Parking's contrived argument and reject it. The IAS is a kangaroo court and is about as corrupt as you can imagine. An IAS rejection would not make the charge lawful, transfer liability to you or bind you. An IAS decision is only binding on the operator if the motorist wins but is not binding on the motorist if the operator wins. If the IAS rejects the appeal, the usual sequence is likely to be:
Debt collectors cannot determine liability, obtain a judgment, send bailiffs or affect your credit record. Their letters are simply powerless demands for payment designed to intimidate the low-hanging fruit on the gullible tree into paying out of ignorance and fear. Just ignore them. Absolutely nothing can or will happen because of them. A Letter of Claim or an actual county court claim must not be ignored, but we would deal with either if one arrived. Why this will not reach a claim hearing (not so) Smart Parking may conceivably issue a speculative claim because issuing claims is relatively cheap and many recipients just panic and pay. Issuing a claim does not mean that (not so) Smart Parking possesses a legally sustainable case or intends to place it before a judge. To reach a hearing against you, (not so) Smart Parking would have to maintain that you were personally the driver despite having no evidence identifying you as such. Its entire case would rest upon:
That does not establish that you entered the alleged parking contract. Nor does it transfer the unknown driver's alleged liability to you. Once a proper defence makes those defects explicit, (not so) Smart Parking and its solicitors would face the prospect of appearing before a judge and attempting to explain:
They will have no satisfactory answers. The commercial purpose of pursuing the charge is to frighten you into paying before judicial scrutiny becomes unavoidable. Once it becomes clear that you understand the distinction between driver and Keeper liability and will defend any claim properly, the commercial value of continuing disappears. For that reason, although threatening debt recovery letters, a Letter of Claim or even a speculative county court claim are possible, this is not realistically going to reach a contested hearing. The highly likely endpoint, if (not so) Smart Parking persists that far, is discontinuance after a defence has been filed. For now, there is nothing to worry about and nothing to pay. The immediate next step is the IAS appeal, which we will deal with separately. RE: 30 min overstay - b789 - 08-24-2026 @Tezzy, use the following as your IAS appeal. You will need to create a PDF file which you will upload to the IAS appeal website. DO NOT select anything that identifies who was driving. Anything selectable that says "I was..." or I did..." must not be used. If possible, only select exclusive options that stay the appellant is the Keeper. The biggest mistake people make when appealing is blabbing the drivers identity, inadvertently or otherwise. Never use "I did this or that", only "the driver did this or that". In the appeal text box, simply say "See the attached/uploaded PDF file with my IAS appeal". Quote:I appeal solely as the registered keeper of the vehicle. The driver has not been identified, and no admission is made concerning the driver's identity. RE: 30 min overstay - Tezzy - 08-24-2026 @b789 That is Awesome, thank you. The appeal via the IAS website has been started but the website is awful! So many hoops to jump thru & so many terms and conditions to accept etc. There is an email address "adr@theias.org" would you advise against sending the PDF directly there? Many thanks RE: 30 min overstay - b789 - 08-24-2026 I would advise that you just jump through the hoops and submit the appeal through their website. As long as you don’t fall into any of the traps that try to get the appellant to admit to driving. Also, don’t give them your phone number. Just an email address. You can put a fake phone number in to get past the requirement to put something in that box. |